Proudly Married: Grand Marshal Duo Brad & George Takei

We have so much to celebrate at this year's San Diego Pride weekend and, to be sure, it's a heady thing to have had the Supreme Court acknowledge the unfairness of Prop. 8 and DOMA - historic, and a long time coming.

We have many examples of relationships that represent who we are as a community, and one of my favorites is that of Grand Marshal married duo Brad and George Takei. Their commitment to each other is deep and lasting and was so before and after marriage. The couple was one of the lucky to be legally married the "first time" during the brief period it was legal in California back in 2008.

Access to legal marriage does not necessarily make a relationship more solid; time, however, does. The defiant act of staying together in love and commitment, over the course of years, is all that more impressive when "lasting" isn't considered important by the world at large.

The Takeis spent the lion's share of their relationship in the "unwed" column, and though much less under the "wedded" title, their dedication to each other is no less apparent -- proving that loving isn't about the validity of the document. But it is sure nice to now have that option.

What a gift, to have an example of two people who are so steadfast, loving and post-nuptual.

Hello George, hello Brad, it's great to talk with you again!

George: Good to be talking to you again. I wanted to thank you for the tremendous support you gave us for "Allegiance"; it helped to break all of those records at The Old Globe!

That is actually one of the questions I hoped to cover. What is happening with the production since last we spoke?

George: We are definitely Broadway bound. We got back last month from a month long workshop where we tweaked it a little bit, cut a little bit and added a little bit. Do you remember the production number "Better Americans and a Greater America?" That's been dropped and in it's place we have a fantastic new number on Baseball called, "Gotta Get in the Game." The "Better Americans" number was a fantasy sequence and the drive of the narrative comes to a brief pause there before go into the fantasy sequence. With baseball as the theme, we have this disparate group of Japanese Americans thrown together in a Camp who needed to gain strength as a community, and so we organize a baseball team. It contrasts strongly with the shattering of the community when the Loyalty Questionnaire comes down.

People because of that loyalty issue started accusing each other of being traitors or turncoats, so the baseball narrative works much, much better. It's an amazing up-tempo number and the choreography is wonderful.

It sounds wonderful; I can't wait to see the production once it is mounted.

Brad: The planets look like might align for next season, but until the right theatre opens up, we can't really start promoting an opening night.

George: You'll have to come and see it.

I will have to make the trip. It's always so much fun to see the changes made on something that you have seen originate before it hits Broadway. We're lucky in San Diego because we get to do that often.

George: Yes, that's for sure, San Diego has produced so many that have gone on to Broadway. Alas, the last two -- "Hands on a Hardbody" and "Chaplin" -- didn't do so well at the box office. That's why we're tweaking "Allegiance" and making it a tighter stronger and more engaging production.

One of my favorite things about the two of you is the way in which you balance each other out so wonderfully. I guess that is probably because you have been together for so long - you're coming up on 26 years now?

George: It's actually passed 26 years now; last February was our "coming together," our commitment to each other.

Brad: We're like a lot of same-sex couples: We for years observed March 5th as our anniversary date, and then we were legally wed on September 14 of 2008, during the window when it was legal. So this September will be our 5th anniversary as a legally married couple and this coming March 5th will be our 27th anniversary as a committed relationship.

So what's your secret? It's a bit of a rarity to have such a long-term relationship.

George: Oh, there are a lot of couples that have been together for a long time that we know. We mustn't perpetuate that stereotype that we are fickle and commitment-avoidant people. Ultimately, that's making a go of living together, it's a series of compromises or you learn a great deal from each other. I think that Brad has learned a lot... (Laughs)

Brad: The answer to your question about keeping a relationship together for me is, that every night we always kiss each other before we go to sleep - even if we have had an argument. But we never have arguments... (George is laughing again). Even if we've argued, we always kiss and make up and try not to hold on to it.

George: Brad may be pouting but we still kiss...

Brad: Okay, well, maybe not always on the lips...

(Laughing)

That is so adorable-there's that balance again. I guess we just don't see long term relationship examples as readily, but if you scratch below the surface there are many, many couples that have been together for a long period of time - having kids, raising families.

George: We are definitely seeing more of that now. Perhaps we're too old, or at least I'm too old, to have had the chance to have a family. At the time and age we could have adopted, at least for me, it was the farthest thing from my imagination. I had more or less resigned myself to not ever having children. I do wish we could have been where we are now when I was younger, because I love children. They make me glow.

We have examples of relationships that are ultimately about day-to-day life and couples that are doing what every other family must do to make it work.

George: Yes, couples like Ellen DeGeneres and Portia DeRossi, or Neil Patrick Harris and David Burtka, make such a difference in the world, to see relationships that are on some level normalized.

We live in a constantly changing society that sometimes steps forewards and sometimes falls backwards. The forward steps are made by those actively engaged in the process, of bringing the ideals of our democracy closer to becoming better and more truthful. When the founding fathers, the great men that articulated the ideals of this country, they other kept other human beings as slaves, and now here we are with an African American as the President of the United States, it's amazing. It's the pessimists that don't make progress. The optimists make the progress, but being engaged all the time, it's a constant effort - pushing and prodding.

Brad: George and I travel constantly; in fact, we were in Toronto yesterday, filming, and this woman approached me and said, "I want you to know how much we appreciate what you and George are doing for the LGBT community." It was a wonderful moment and we get that kind of feedback constantly.

The truth is, we're sort of just living our lives, but the key is that we are living our lives openly. So many young LGBT people are not able to do that... Even in the year 2013 they are still not able to do it.

That's why I think it's so important that George and I maintain a high profile - it inspires hope on some level. The idea that it normalizes two men as a couple is important and for the two of us, it's just living our lives, normally and openly.

It is a curious thing to me regarding the religious communities' opposition and its vehemence - it is difficult to understand the power behind it.

George: The response for things like that is simple: "We have respect for your religious beliefs, but we have this thing called the separation of church and state. Civil law applies to everybody, and no faith has the right to write faith-based values into civil code."

Brad and I are Buddhists and we don't even consider writing our beliefs into civil law. It's not even supposed because we are a small minority in this country. If we tried to do that, there would be outrage.

There needs to be mutual respect. Everyone has the right to [their] faith, and we are a multi-faith nation. That's how we were founded, inclusive of freedom of religion. If a particular faith wants to be respected, then it must respect others by keeping its ideologies to themselves. You can't impose a religious belief on others who might not share it - in particular when it comes to civil law.

I support wholeheartedly, one's right to believe what one believes, the right to practice one's faith is an inherent right. It's when a religious ideology is used to determine civil law or to curtail the liberties of others that I take issue.

George: Exactly that. Because law applies to everybody, [and] faith is a personal choice.

Brad: When we were involved in the San Diego market, as intensively as we were with The Old Globe, we had many meetings with donors and supporters who would be considered conservative. And yet, George and I felt totally welcomed by that group.

There is a certain duplicity in America right now. We as gay people entertain and contribute to American culture, but there is still a standard that is unequal when it comes to being a full participant. That is why I think that it is so important to be open. The more George and I attend events as a couple, participate in Pride parades and are seen, it's a way for fair-minded Americans to connect with us. It's a way to help them see that maybe we do deserve a piece of the pie.

That is such a wise perspective. It is so important to be engaged, especially with those who may not be comfortable. Changing perceptions do not happen if there is nothing pushing that change.

George: The majority of Americans are decent and fair-minded, hard-working people. Due to the difficulty of earning a living sometimes, they just don't have time to sit and consider the issues that may confront others.

It's one of the reasons I chose to be a part of the Howard Stern Show, and yes, he has a ribald, raucous sense of humor, but ultimately he has a large middle-American audience filled with people who are decent and fair-minded.

During the show I would talk about Brad as my husband, just like any straight couple would discuss a husband or wife. The conversation would sound so normal, and help to break down the stereotypes the audience might have had.

Sure, there are extremes they are a part of any community, but that's not the only part of it, there is so much more to it. We all have jobs, lives and children - they may be families with two daddies or two mommies, but that is the only difference.

By doing so we show them that we are loving decent people and they can start to see that in many ways we are just like them. We have received many emails from people, even republicans who are saying that they will support LGBT rights and fight any attempt to take them away. Those decent, hardworking Americans are the people we need to engage with.

You are so correct, the tide is definitely changing, the people I chat with who are under 30 are of a completely different mind-set - it's very encouraging.

Brad: I agree completely. And since you are in the San Diego market, I want to acknowledge the military community in the sense that we are finding an immense support there. George is doing a talk with U.S. Air Force this October in Los Angeles, and it is the first time that he has been invited to talk at an Air Force-sponsored event as an open LGBT American.

I believe on some level that one of the shifts that occurred was the change in the military policies; it opened the door for a broader change. That great bastion of power being asked to change had a ripple effect.

George: Wasn't it truly amazing to see that heart-warming photo of the husband waiting for his partner's return -- I think it was the Navy -- and the wonderful embrace and kiss? It reminded me of the famous photo of VJ Day kiss from WWII. It was wonderful.

That was beautiful. It reminded me of the emotional moment during our pride parade last year when for the first time in history, active military personnel were allowed to walk in uniform, with their spouses and families. I tell you, it brought many of us to tears.

George: Bravo! See, change does happen! Like Harvey Milk said, "We do want to recruit you!"